Entitlements

Hello,

As entitlements apply to the U.S. and the U.S. economy, what are your opinions on it? I have a research project on it due and I haven't done much research, so the most logical place for me to go is AtWar.

Personally, I think we should exterminate all the old and disabled, and provide no financial aid to the poor. I'm not sure how this will go over with my teacher, but if there's a better and more feasible way by which the United States might achieve similar results, please elaborate below.

Thank you

Just build that wall on the Mexican border.

Cant tell if ur trolling or being super edgy
1st off both ur solutions are literally impossible so i dont understand why u would even want to put them in ur paper unless ur teacher is an actual retard
2nd wtf u want 2 exterminate elderly and retards wtf with gas chambers???
3rd i dont see the issue with the idea of giving financial aid to low income families??
4th what results are u talking about how the fuck am i suppose to answer when i have no clue what u want to achieve

How about a story...
When Bob was 6 years old, he started going to Elementary School. There he met a girl called Alexis and she became his first ever girlfriend in second grade.

When Bob graduated from grade 6, he started going to Middle School. It was there that he learned about algebra and English and Spanish and all the things that the grown-ups wouldn't let him know before. Then, Bob went to high school, and it was there that he once again became friends with Alexis. They started talking and Bob soon fell in love.

For the first time, he fell in love for real. For him, school was a gift. He'd met Alexis. He'd gone through the voyage of maturing into an adult through school.

What's the moral of the story? Maybe you are rich and well off and went to private school. But Bob wasn't. Bob came from the average American family, able to put food on the table three times a day but not able to buy Bob that $10,000 car he wanted at 16 years old. Bob went to school because there were people kind enough to pay taxes. Without them there would be no school. No money to pay teachers.

Why should you help people? You do it because one day they will help you too. You never know when, you never know how, but it will happen. And when it happens, oh boy will you be glad. Everyone is selfish in some way, and helping others can be a manifestation of that as well. You help others because they will help you one day. It might be more ideal and practical but in every practicality lies some sort of ideal that encourage people to work towards something anyways.

Ecrit par Puf, 06.09.2018 at 02:03

How about a story...
When Bob was 6 years old, he started going to Elementary School. There he met a girl called Alexis and she became his first ever girlfriend in second grade.

When Bob graduated from grade 6, he started going to Middle School. It was there that he learned about algebra and English and Spanish and all the things that the grown-ups wouldn't let him know before. Then, Bob went to high school, and it was there that he once again became friends with Alexis. They started talking and Bob soon fell in love.

For the first time, he fell in love for real. For him, school was a gift. He'd met Alexis. He'd gone through the voyage of maturing into an adult through school.

What's the moral of the story? Maybe you are rich and well off and went to private school. But Bob wasn't. Bob came from the average American family, able to put food on the table three times a day but not able to buy Bob that $10,000 car he wanted at 16 years old. Bob went to school because there were people kind enough to pay taxes. Without them there would be no school. No money to pay teachers.

Why should you help people? You do it because one day they will help you too. You never know when, you never know how, but it will happen. And when it happens, oh boy will you be glad. Everyone is selfish in some way, and helping others can be a manifestation of that as well. You help others because they will help you one day. It might be more ideal and practical but in every practicality lies some sort of ideal that encourage people to work towards something anyways.

So we pay taxes so Bob can lose his virginity?

Outside of trolling nice story....very heartouching..... 10/10

Ecrit par Tribune Aquila, 05.09.2018 at 08:14

Hello,

As entitlements apply to the U.S. and the U.S. economy, what are your opinions on it? I have a research project on it due and I haven't done much research, so the most logical place for me to go is AtWar.

Personally, I think we should exterminate all the old and disabled, and provide no financial aid to the poor. I'm not sure how this will go over with my teacher, but if there's a better and more feasible way by which the United States might achieve similar results, please elaborate below.

Thank you

I semi agree with you not to the point of killing people but i think to cut everyones taxes down
People need to take care of their own future
And now adays there is no reason to have a mentally dissabled child
You know it will be mentally dissabled long before its born
Either abort or take care of them by yourself
And im talking as a person who has a semi retarted sister and my wife has a mentally dissabled brother
I love them but i think they would have been far better not born for them and for the famillys
And definitely for the tax payer

About helping the poor
I dont see why we are forced to help them
And i dont understand why you get tax breaks if you have kids
That just forces people that have no money
To have kids so they get tax breaks

Imo democracy and capitalism
Mean you have the ability to make out of your life whatever you want
If you want to be a shit stain on society's ass
Thats fine but we shouldnt be forced to finance your life choices.

TLDR
To cut taxes down by a third at least
Cancel social security and disability
And force people to deal with life.

Ecrit par 1GodofWar1, 06.09.2018 at 09:36

Ecrit par Tribune Aquila, 05.09.2018 at 08:14

Hello,

As entitlements apply to the U.S. and the U.S. economy, what are your opinions on it? I have a research project on it due and I haven't done much research, so the most logical place for me to go is AtWar.

Personally, I think we should exterminate all the old and disabled, and provide no financial aid to the poor. I'm not sure how this will go over with my teacher, but if there's a better and more feasible way by which the United States might achieve similar results, please elaborate below.

Thank you

I semi agree with you not to the point of killing people but i think to cut everyones taxes down
People need to take care of their own future
And now adays there is no reason to have a mentally dissabled child
You know it will be mentally dissabled long before its born
Either abort or take care of them by yourself
And im talking as a person who has a semi retarted sister and my wife has a mentally dissabled brother
I love them but i think they would have been far better not born for them and for the famillys
And definitely for the tax payer

About helping the poor
I dont see why we are forced to help them
And i dont understand why you get tax breaks if you have kids
That just forces people that have no money
To have kids so they get tax breaks

Imo democracy and capitalism
Mean you have the ability to make out of your life whatever you want
If you want to be a shit stain on society's ass
Thats fine but we shouldnt be forced to finance your life choices.

TLDR
To cut taxes down by a third at least
Cancel social security and disability
And force people to deal with life.

Thats cruel.I agree with you but i would never say it would be better for them not to be born after i met them.They are just slower than us.Not different but uniqe.Respect.Also i love to talk with those type of people they are pure,like kids they have fun and make you respect the little things in life like pure love or humor.

Ecrit par 1GodofWar1, 06.09.2018 at 09:36

I semi agree with you not to the point of killing people but i think to cut everyones taxes down
People need to take care of their own future
And now adays there is no reason to have a mentally dissabled child
You know it will be mentally dissabled long before its born
Either abort or take care of them by yourself
And im talking as a person who has a semi retarted sister and my wife has a mentally dissabled brother
I love them but i think they would have been far better not born for them and for the famillys
And definitely for the tax payer

About helping the poor
I dont see why we are forced to help them
And i dont understand why you get tax breaks if you have kids
That just forces people that have no money
To have kids so they get tax breaks

Imo democracy and capitalism
Mean you have the ability to make out of your life whatever you want
If you want to be a shit stain on society's ass
Thats fine but we shouldnt be forced to finance your life choices.

TLDR
To cut taxes down by a third at least
Cancel social security and disability
And force people to deal with life.

Thank you for your response. The thing is, I go to a Catholic school, and if I ever remotely suggested something like this, I'd probably be kicked out. I think what I'll do is discuss the history of entitlements (social security, medicare, medicaid), why they were incorporated in the U.S. and how we might take steps to reverse the damage they have already done - and will continue to do - to the U.S. economy.

Thanks

This thread is degenerate

Ecrit par 4nic, 06.09.2018 at 14:53

This thread is degenerate

Not much unlike yourself, rp fag

Ecrit par Tribune Aquila, 06.09.2018 at 14:55

Ecrit par 4nic, 06.09.2018 at 14:53

This thread is degenerate

Not much unlike yourself, rp fag

''personally i think we should exterminate all the old and disabled''
easy there thanos

Ecrit par 1GodofWar1, 06.09.2018 at 09:36

Ecrit par Tribune Aquila, 05.09.2018 at 08:14

Hello,

As entitlements apply to the U.S. and the U.S. economy, what are your opinions on it? I have a research project on it due and I haven't done much research, so the most logical place for me to go is AtWar.

Personally, I think we should exterminate all the old and disabled, and provide no financial aid to the poor. I'm not sure how this will go over with my teacher, but if there's a better and more feasible way by which the United States might achieve similar results, please elaborate below.

Thank you

I semi agree with you not to the point of killing people but i think to cut everyones taxes down
People need to take care of their own future
And now adays there is no reason to have a mentally dissabled child
You know it will be mentally dissabled long before its born
Either abort or take care of them by yourself
And im talking as a person who has a semi retarted sister and my wife has a mentally dissabled brother
I love them but i think they would have been far better not born for them and for the famillys
And definitely for the tax payer

About helping the poor
I dont see why we are forced to help them
And i dont understand why you get tax breaks if you have kids
That just forces people that have no money
To have kids so they get tax breaks

Imo democracy and capitalism
Mean you have the ability to make out of your life whatever you want
If you want to be a shit stain on society's ass
Thats fine but we shouldnt be forced to finance your life choices.

TLDR
To cut taxes down by a third at least
Cancel social security and disability
And force people to deal with life.

1. u dont know if the child will be born with mental disabilities
2. i will write this later
3. not everyome has the ability to make out life however they want. tell that 2 the kids in the ghettos who eant to be doctors but cant even dream about becoming one cuz they cant afford med school

Citer:

Ecrit par winkcat, 06.09.2018 at 16:06

1. u dont know if the child will be born with mental disabilities
2. i will write this later
3. not everyome has the ability to make out life however they want. tell that 2 the kids in the ghettos who eant to be doctors but cant even dream about becoming one cuz they cant afford med school

1. You actually do.
Do you live under a rock?
They knew back in the 90s as well but now they know much earlier into the pregnancy.
2.lazy
3. All i hear is excuses
Anyone from the getto that really wanted to make something out of their life did.
I was kicked out of home when i was 14
Drugs alcohol and street life were my norm.
When i decided to pick myself up
I put myself through school
Fast forward 16 years
Im 30 own a successful business and drive a 2019 60k usd truck

Its all about how hard you are willing to work
If you are you will succeed

Now go and rethink your life please.

Citer:

Ecrit par 1GodofWar1, 06.09.2018 at 21:19

Ecrit par winkcat, 06.09.2018 at 16:06

1. u dont know if the child will be born with mental disabilities
2. i will write this later
3. not everyome has the ability to make out life however they want. tell that 2 the kids in the ghettos who eant to be doctors but cant even dream about becoming one cuz they cant afford med school

Its all about how hard you are willing to work
If you are you will succeed

ya that's why most billionaires inherited their wealth from the parents. Being born is hard work.

Ecrit par winkcat, 06.09.2018 at 16:06

1. u dont know if the child will be born with mental disabilities
2. i will write this later
3. not everyome has the ability to make out life however they want. tell that 2 the kids in the ghettos who eant to be doctors but cant even dream about becoming one cuz they cant afford med school

Boywind,
I'm gonna write you one message, and one message only. I don't care if you read it or not, it's up to you. You can either remain ignorant of those who disagree with you, or you can consider opposing views in an effort to determine what is truly just in society.

There are three types of people who "require" or are supposedly "entitled" to government aid: the old, the poor, and the disabled. The thing is, when the government does provide entitlements to the old, poor, and disabled, what this does is it makes these people dependent on the government.. They depend on the government, they depend on private charity because they refuse to depend on themselves. Providing aid to these people actually encourages them NOT to work, it encourages them NOT to be self-sufficient, it encourages them to GIVE UP their rights and place their very lives into the hands of an impersonal government that will use this newly found power to not necessarily expand entitlements, but to serve its own bureaucratic interests.

How can you not understand this? I understand that when you look at a poor person, when you look at a black-ghetto person, it's easy to say "oh, here's my money, please don't be poor anymore! If I give you money, then you won't be poor anymore, right?" NO! This is wrong! And this is evil! Throwing money at the poor does NOTHING to actually solve the poverty crisis! Throwing money at the poor does NOTHING to target the underlying factors that contribute to America's poverty! It's like a bandaid, all it does it provide temporary relief. What we need is true healing, we need true, incremental healing that will work towards resolving poverty in America. What we don't need are people like you!

The only reason why U.S. politicians are allowing entitlements to persist is not because they make sense, it's not because they are economically good, it's not because they're moral, it is SOLELY because it's the easiest way to stay in power! Most of America relies on social security, medicaid, medicare, and all other forms of entitlements, do you know how many votes this generates? People will vote for whoever guarantees them the money they're "entitled" to. This basically means that politicians are PAYING people for their votes. WE CANNOT LET THIS CONTINUE! THIS MUST END!

Fuck democracy! We need someone to end this once and for all, we need someone to put America back on track IMMEDIATELY. There's a thing called relative power and absolute power. Relatively, America is falling behind CHINA. Are you kidding me? CHINA. I can't fucking believe it! CHINA of all the places on this god forsaken fucking Earth, CHINA! This isn't right! America is not reaching its fullest potential as a nation. We could be so much more, we are falling behind, we are not the great power we used to be. We are losing this great war. The real war we're fighting isn't a tangible, armed war, but a war among civilizations. WE MUST FIGHT, not for ourselves, but for freedom, for western civilization, for our posterity, for our family, and FOR OUR COUNTRY!

I'm sick and fucking tired of hearing all this BULL SHIT all the fucking time. I'm fucking done. We need a dictatorial force to BRING AMERICA BACK ON TRACK. I want a peaceful world, I want a powerful America, I want a prosperous America, I want a GREAT America, I am in support of ANY means that will satisfy these ends. We must exterminate the old, we must exterminate the disabled, and we must exterminate the poor if we are EVER to bring this country back on track, if we are EVER to make this country as powerful as it could be! You are either with the United States on its path to greatness, or you are against it! And if you're against it, you will die!

Boywind, you are a communist, you are from Venezuela, you support Maduro. I hate everything you and your communist state stands for.

I got emotional in the end, but what I'm trying to say is that we should probably confine entitlements into a limited benefit and create block grants for programs like medicaid so states can target their resources to those in true need of aid. That way, our economy won't be as bad as projected because, at this point, it's not feasible to totally abandon America's social welfare system.

Citer:

Ecrit par 1GodofWar1, 06.09.2018 at 21:19

Ecrit par winkcat, 06.09.2018 at 16:06

1. u dont know if the child will be born with mental disabilities
2. i will write this later
3. not everyome has the ability to make out life however they want. tell that 2 the kids in the ghettos who eant to be doctors but cant even dream about becoming one cuz they cant afford med school

1. You actually do.
Do you live under a rock?
They knew back in the 90s as well but now they know much earlier into the pregnancy.
2.lazy
3. All i hear is excuses
Anyone from the getto that really wanted to make something out of their life did.
I was kicked out of home when i was 14
Drugs alcohol and street life were my norm.
When i decided to pick myself up
I put myself through school
Fast forward 16 years
Im 30 own a successful business and drive a 2019 60k usd truck

Its all about how hard you are willing to work
If you are you will succeed

Now go and rethink your life please.

1. physical disabilities yes. mental disabilities no test will say for certain that the child will have a mental disability until they are born retard
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3597781/
2. you help the poor to prevent the income gap widening further i dont think i have to tell you why income inequality is bad so ill leave it to your imagination.
3. you can tell me how gr8 ur life is on this estonian risk game. you can tell me how u heroically fought ur demons, said drugs are no! no! and how u rose up among these poor worthless ghetto fucks who cant compare to u. but in the end none of that what u say fucking matters because one person's story doesnt reflect every1 elses.

also ur story doesnt make any sense in the first place. if you got kicked out of ur house at the age of 14, how did u go to school? where did u sleep? i can guarantee there is no way in hell u can make it alone on the streets as a 14 year old without having a gaping asshole.

jesus how much of a faggot do u have to be to mention ur successful business every chance u get. talk about suckin ur own dick lol

Ecrit par Tribune Aquila, 06.09.2018 at 22:22

Ecrit par winkcat, 06.09.2018 at 16:06

1. u dont know if the child will be born with mental disabilities
2. i will write this later
3. not everyome has the ability to make out life however they want. tell that 2 the kids in the ghettos who eant to be doctors but cant even dream about becoming one cuz they cant afford med school

underaged, cringy and retarded

yeah im a communist because i think helping the poor by giving them more educational opportunities, food stamps, tax breaks and etc

DUR GUYZ POLITICIANS R MILKING VOTES USING ENTITLEMENTS no shit u fucking retard. thats why i said in the first place there is no solution to social security even though the funds will run dry in the next couple decades

see godofwar, this is an example of someone who is retarded but wasnt detected at birth
FUCK DEMOCRACY WE NEED A DICTATORIAL FORSE DW THOUGH ITS FOR FREEDUMBBBBBBB

how bout u show us the way by killing ur grandparents first then u can kill urself cuz u are a downy!

haha, u didnt make this thread to as for differing opinions u literally just made this so u can justify ur retarded belifs and hope that other downies agree with u

jesus i can literally smell ur fedora tipping autism through the fucking monitor bro. i advise taking off that fedora and sheathing ur katana, thanks

Citer:

Ecrit par Witch-Doctor, 06.09.2018 at 21:21

Ecrit par 1GodofWar1, 06.09.2018 at 21:19

Ecrit par winkcat, 06.09.2018 at 16:06

1. u dont know if the child will be born with mental disabilities
2. i will write this later
3. not everyome has the ability to make out life however they want. tell that 2 the kids in the ghettos who eant to be doctors but cant even dream about becoming one cuz they cant afford med school

Its all about how hard you are willing to work
If you are you will succeed

ya that's why most billionaires inherited their wealth from the parents. Being born is hard work.

I didnt say life cant be easy
We just talked about poor people
Even a billionare family worked hard to get to that point
If not the parents so the great grandparents
And so on.
Yes there is alot of luck involved
And no you probably wont be a billionare
Unless you were born into money
But you dont need to be a billionare to have aenough to live comfortably.

Citer:

Ecrit par winkcat, 07.09.2018 at 00:49

Ecrit par 1GodofWar1, 06.09.2018 at 21:19

Ecrit par winkcat, 06.09.2018 at 16:06

1. u dont know if the child will be born with mental disabilities
2. i will write this later
3. not everyome has the ability to make out life however they want. tell that 2 the kids in the ghettos who eant to be doctors but cant even dream about becoming one cuz they cant afford med school

1. You actually do.
Do you live under a rock?
They knew back in the 90s as well but now they know much earlier into the pregnancy.
2.lazy
3. All i hear is excuses
Anyone from the getto that really wanted to make something out of their life did.
I was kicked out of home when i was 14
Drugs alcohol and street life were my norm.
When i decided to pick myself up
I put myself through school
Fast forward 16 years
Im 30 own a successful business and drive a 2019 60k usd truck

Its all about how hard you are willing to work
If you are you will succeed

Now go and rethink your life please.

1. physical disabilities yes. mental disabilities no test will say for certain that the child will have a mental disability until they are born retard
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3597781/
2. you help the poor to prevent the income gap widening further i dont think i have to tell you why income inequality is bad so ill leave it to your imagination.
3. you can tell me how gr8 ur life is on this estonian risk game. you can tell me how u heroically fought ur demons, said drugs are no! no! and how u rose up among these poor worthless ghetto fucks who cant compare to u. but in the end none of that what u say fucking matters because one person's story doesnt reflect every1 elses.

also ur story doesnt make any sense in the first place. if you got kicked out of ur house at the age of 14, how did u go to school? where did u sleep? i can guarantee there is no way in hell u can make it alone on the streets as a 14 year old without having a gaping asshole.

jesus how much of a faggot do u have to be to mention ur successful business every chance u get. talk about suckin ur own dick lol

You would be surprised what a resourceful
14 yo can do.
Yes i slept on a bench and abandoned buildings for 2 years
No i didnt go to high school
I put myself through chef school at 18
No i didnt have my asshole pillaged
Not all 14 yo are wimpy shits like yourself
And yes i am proud of my business
And my life

Idc if you belive me or not but my story is one of tens of thousands of storys at least of people who made a great life after growing up in garbage.
The point was to show you that growing up with a shit family in a shit neighborhood
Does not have to determine your future.

Btw i was only talking about actual disabilities
And diseases
Not crazy people.

Lets put it this way
If you help the poor live the way they live
Your keeping them in poverty
Teaching them how to be lazy
And aiding them in their shit lifestyle.

Gow and sean spicer should've been born in india working for 20 cents a day lets see how successful theyd become and not rely on the community for welfare and shit.
legit in some places people work their whole lives 12 hours a day of hard labour and cant see the light of day, then some lazy autistic teen sean spicer makes this nonsense topic, with 0 research on how stuff like pensions and welfare actually HELP the economy since the product and demand goes higher for certain stuff; but lets not digg into that...
point is sean and gow are retards just lock the topic.

Ecrit par 1GodofWar1, 07.09.2018 at 08:31

Lets put it this way
If you help the poor live the way they live
Your keeping them in poverty
Teaching them how to be lazy
And aiding them in their shit lifestyle.

HAHAHAHAHAH CAN YOU IMAGINE
A POOR KID FROM THE GHETTOS WANTS TO BE A DOCTOR BUT CANT AFFORD MED SCHOOL
GOW IS JUST STANDING THERE JUST SAYING UR JUST LAZY JUST TRY HARDER U JUST HAVE A SHIT LIFESTYLE
BRO I GOT A SUCCESSFUL BUSINESS BRO JUST GOTTA TRY HARDER BRO

NO HIGH SCHOOL HE SAYS
HOMELESS AT 14 BUT SOMEHOW HAS THE MONEY TO GO TO A CHEF SCHOOL HE SAYS
I WAS TALKING ABOUT ACTUAL DISABILITIES HE SAYS

IMAGINE BEING 4'4 BELIEVING THAT MENTAL RETARDATION ISNT A REAL DISABILITY
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHA NOPE THEY'RE JUST CRAZIES

Ecrit par 4nic, 07.09.2018 at 11:21

Gow and sean spicer should've been born in india working for 20 cents a day lets see how successful theyd become and not rely on the community for welfare and shit.
legit in some places people work their whole lives 12 hours a day of hard labour and cant see the light of day, then some lazy autistic teen sean spicer makes this nonsense topic, with 0 research on how stuff like pensions and welfare actually HELP the economy since the product and demand goes higher for certain stuff; but lets not digg into that...
point is sean and gow are retards just lock the topic.

You are a complete moron
We are obv only talking about USA
Yeah life is shit most of the world
I didnt say dont help them
Im talking about all the lazy muricans

Ecrit par winkcat, 07.09.2018 at 14:37

Ecrit par 1GodofWar1, 07.09.2018 at 08:31

Lets put it this way
If you help the poor live the way they live
Your keeping them in poverty
Teaching them how to be lazy
And aiding them in their shit lifestyle.

HAHAHAHAHAH CAN YOU IMAGINE
A POOR KID FROM THE GHETTOS WANTS TO BE A DOCTOR BUT CANT AFFORD MED SCHOOL
GOW IS JUST STANDING THERE JUST SAYING UR JUST LAZY JUST TRY HARDER U JUST HAVE A SHIT LIFESTYLE
BRO I GOT A SUCCESSFUL BUSINESS BRO JUST GOTTA TRY HARDER BRO

NO HIGH SCHOOL HE SAYS
HOMELESS AT 14 BUT SOMEHOW HAS THE MONEY TO GO TO A CHEF SCHOOL HE SAYS
I WAS TALKING ABOUT ACTUAL DISABILITIES HE SAYS

IMAGINE BEING 4'4 BELIEVING THAT MENTAL RETARDATION ISNT A REAL DISABILITY
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHA NOPE THEY'RE JUST CRAZIES

I worked 12 hour shifts moron
And so did anyone who wanted to put himself through med school
Btw most people take loans to go to school here
But i dont expect a retard that should have been aborted to understand anything about hard work.

Ecrit par 1GodofWar1, 07.09.2018 at 20:09

Ecrit par 4nic, 07.09.2018 at 11:21

Gow and sean spicer should've been born in india working for 20 cents a day lets see how successful theyd become and not rely on the community for welfare and shit.
legit in some places people work their whole lives 12 hours a day of hard labour and cant see the light of day, then some lazy autistic teen sean spicer makes this nonsense topic, with 0 research on how stuff like pensions and welfare actually HELP the economy since the product and demand goes higher for certain stuff; but lets not digg into that...
point is sean and gow are retards just lock the topic.

You are a complete moron
We are obv only talking about USA
Yeah life is shit most of the world
I didnt say dont help them
Im talking about all the lazy muricans

pensions and welfare help the economy

1 of the considerations for judging how advanced any civilization equates to others is by the way it protects/cares for its old/infirm/weak & dibilitated.
military/fiscal success are recent values considered advancement but not neccessarily civil.

who are "the old" ? logans run ! where effort/knowledge/advancement/civilization/choice are all irrelevant & redundant.