Turkish attack on Afrin
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Le message original
Posté par Zephyrusu, 20.01.2018 - 16:42
Those one-liners really show how ignorant you are. Read about your own country and tip that hat of yours through your head, you'll need it to counter the shame.
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Edit Turkish attack on Kurds Btw Kurds are stronk #FreeKurdistan
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Why dont you read about the atrocities commited by portugal in your colonies. Oh that would be too painful for an ultranationalist portugeese like you to handle.
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I know about the atrocities we committed in Portuguese Africa in the Ultramar War. That war is funny because your boy Kennedy betrayed us by funding Communist Guerrillas in a time of cold war where the Soviets and the Cubans were also waging war there. Geopolitical hypocrisy at its best (also we were winning the war in all fronts except Guinea, using WW1 rifles and shitty 50's guns xd) We did commit Atrocities throughout history, and I, as a proud Portuguese, nationalist indeed (the term has a negative conotation but it's nothing like that as portrayed), I'm the first to admit that. Portugal is the #1 guilty for the African slave trade from Africa to the Americas and Europe. Infact, we had 60% of the Slave Trade at some time. Most of th african-americans and other africans and its descendants you see in US and other places of the American continent are there because of us Portuguese. But the Spanish did it way worse. It's estimated that they slaughtered 25 to 50 million natives throughout their Imperial Era (that ended with the independence of Equatorial Guinea and them abandoning Western Sahara in the 20th century (though some believe it ended with the Spanish-American War), so in comparison to the Spanish and even the French and the English in China and India and the Germans who perpetrated the first genocide of the 20th century in Namibia, we're not that bad. And don't forget the Americans and the Trail of Tears and the total genocide and extermination of native-americans, chased like animals from their lands and confined to reserves as if they were zoo animals. I can admit my country's flaws, you seem to not handle yours sadly. (and yes, I could be here all day saying all our failures lol) Edit: I'm also much well aware about the atrocities of the Ultramar War especially as my grandfather, veteran lieutenant-colonel of the air force (commanding choppers) who fought in the Ultramar War in the front with most atrocities (Angola) has a book and an archive of which I inherited describing the atrocities the Portuguese Settlers committed in response to the African Terrorists, who did way worse.
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Both of you are ignorant as fuck and know nothing about whats really going on in Syria. First, what you call "Rebels" are mostly foreign elements complemented by internal elements who seek to overthrow a legitimate elected government of a UN member country by use of lethal force. No amount of rhetoric towards the 'illegitimacy of the government' by external sources can change that. They are by definition and under the law, traitors and terrorists. Second, What you call 'Rebels' are all Islamists. From innumerable islamist groups under ISIL umbrella to another host of innumerable radical extremist groups 'Army of Conquest' (which Turkey backs and Al Nusra, Al Qaeda. There aren't any non radical islamist segment fighting Syrian Government, because the main backer of this stampede is Saudi Arabia. It would be absurd for Saudi Arabia to be funding and arming secular, modernist, western rebels, or * gasp * socialists, communists and the like. Assad is not a saint but FSA has done the same and worse and if it succeded, Syria would have ended up with a radical islamist government just like how it happened in Libya Who can forget the footage of the FSA commander carving out a heart of a dead Syrian Arab Army soldier and eating it before the camera. Who can forget the scenes from the early days of the Western-led intervention in Syria through these mercenaries having slaughtered and lynched tens of Syrian security officers in what's now called Jisr Shoghour Massacre after they ran out of ammo. Who can forget the throwing of post office workers off the rooftop of Al-Bab Post Office in northern Syria by a group of the FSA (all in the early days of the Crisis)? Who can forget throwing the bodies of murdered policemen in the city of Hama off a bridge into the Orontes (Assi) River? Who can forget the fire shooting of the elders of the Berri Tribe in Aleppo Countryside? Jandar Massacre? Al-Bayda Massacre? The Human Slaughter House in Baba Amro, Homs where FSA terrorists were chopping up their victims and selling human organs to traffickers from Turkey and Israel through neighboring Lebanon? Who can forget detonating cars filled with explosives next to schools, mosques, and churches? The indiscriminate mortar shelling of neighborhoods and sometimes who cities like the case of Jaramana by FSA terrorists? and hundreds of more stories 
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Alawites are 15% of the Syrian population yet they created oligarchy to take all government companies and economical sectors for themselves. Many Syrians got forced to join the army just as labor force in Alawwite drug fields and factories. the thing is Syrians can't even do anything about it by using democratic tools because mircally Assad wins elections by 90% gap every time. same problem happened with Iraq. after finally beating ISIS shiite government started persue Sunni majority again. The thing is Syria is not as mixed as Iraq. most of Alawiites live in the coast and can peacefully seperate. Imagine Catalonian or Basque leader becomes a dictator in Spain. I can understand your opinion that they better be supressed under less religious regime than be equally governed by Sharia Law. but most Syrians disagree with you. things will float up eventually. If they are not going to solve that problem It's just matter of time before war breaks again.
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Ofcourse you can always nominate crazy ass dictator like Sadaam that will keep the country busy in wars and genocides every five years. that will do.
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hahahah are you really talking shit about saddam? because he launched 39 rockets at your made up country? i wonder how palestinians feel wherever they walk theres some osraeli rocket that exploded nearby. believe it or not, iraqis loved saddam the biggest majority. he never took tax from people, free healthcare, free education, the poor were being helped, everyone wasfree to practice his own religion and no injustice were done to the people. the people in iraq had a very happy life believe it or not, and their economy was one of the best. stop giving people false ideas just because your hate for saddam is supported by mainstream medias
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yes i know nothing about my country teach me any idea why fsa are mostly muslims?  oh no way that could happen surely they are isis related coming from other countries serving our best friends isis/alnusra/alquaeda/what ever has hashtag of islam+terrorism etc also no idea why isis claimed deiralzour off FSA at the start and massively helped assad opening another front at fsa and they are fighting in idlib northern of syria as we speak and at israel's borders human organs doesnt last more then one day after the person dies and they need too many tests to see if they are poisoned/ infected / kind of organs/ blood kind and the rezos part, but what ever your anti islam/one sided media says also never forget that saudis are in the end american dummies and america has the biggest profit of this war beside russia and iran who gained more lands and sold their arms but you choose to blame a religion for all kind of horrible shits that happens in this world this gay logic... i have fsa fighter relatives tho and im pretty sure they aren't fighting over religion rather because of the random capturing by government in their areas, they take random people in buses force them to do shits like looting severely humiliating anybody that even shows disappointment just fuck this corrupted government there's no government building that you do not have to pay bribes to take what ever you want from and there's nobody that punishes them...
---- Our next Moments are Tomorrows Memories
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1- Sadaam was fiercely popular among the Iraqi's 2- Iraq was the strongest middle-eastern economy, or on the way to become it 3- Iraq was among the top (?) strongest armies in the world, in terms of manpower and readyness and gear 4- Iraqi society was actually progressive enough and upheld tolerance as a core value to keep the vitality of the Iraqi State. 5- Did you get that opinion from Bush? lmao
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Tbh I couldn't care less about Israel being hit by the civil war, I mean, 6 days war karma must get to them xD Also, it's widely documented now that the State and Government buildings are riddled with corruption but it's not gonna be an imported democratic form of government that will save Syria. Perhaps if Assad gets toppled, the FSA, being a fuckton of converged rebel groups will divide into several minor branches that will ambition government and then a Libya will happen and by the time you realize it you'll have another long-lasting civil war
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Jesus fucking christ. I will respond to that Sadaam shit when i have acess to laptop if Khal doesnt respond before me. Just before I do ut are there any others who think Sadaam was girt to humanity?
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youre wrong. you hate him cuz he spoke the truth about israel. you never have any historical facts , you talk history with your emotions nit facts
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Yeah Iraqis definitely loved Iraq and Iraq was so cool under Saddam, that's why there were two Kurdish mass uprisings and two Shia mass uprisings during his reign and that's why Iraq miserably lost against Iran despite having both American and Soviet support. Also to clear some matters Iraq is majority Shia not majority Sunni. When it comes to Syria, the US' intention never was to gain control of Syria: Instead, it was to neutralise Syria. They care little about the chaos that would ensue, so long as it is not a Russian/Irani ally. Nevertheless it's obvious the so-called "FSA", now dominated by Islamist elements, has already lost the war. Idlib is about to fall and the SAA have been advancing steadily in Damascus. That's why the current USA-supported faction in Syria is the SDF. The SDF feel threatened by Assad now that he has no other enemies and also need US support against Turkey, thus it is understandable that they'd act as their allies, nevertheless that might end up being a mistake since they have pushed Russia away and worsened relations with the government, though I still hope Rojava can remain as an autonomous region in Syria after the war. Assad is a bad leader, and there's no question about that. If his regime magically disappeared and was replaced by a democracy or even a different dictatorhip Syria would probably be better off, but that's not what's happening, a government defeat would only need to anarchy and not any kind of new order. It also needs to be mentioned that Assad's treatment of Sunnis is much better than a Sunni regime's treatment of Shias, Christians or Druzes would've been. I do not see why Israel is part of this discussion as they have only partaken in some skirmishes in the Golan Heights. Ultimately if we had to blame a single country most it'd be Saudi Arabia, with their shameless funding of terrorist and Islamist organisations and continued liberty to do so. Oh, and I forgot about Turkey. Turkey is being a butthurt child that is trying to deny reality (reality being the existence of Kurds in general) and is invading perhaps the most democratic government in all of the Middle East just because they feel like it accusing it of "terrorism". I sincerely hope Erdogan dies in a fire pit.
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Launching missiles at Israel is nearly irrelevant compared to tyranny the torture assasinations wars collective punishment and damage for century he had caused Iraq.
He was so loved he had to create spy them with secret police. assasinate his family bribe the riches, turn 7500 square miles of agricultural land to desert as punishment and use chemical weapons to stay in power
Let start with some facts: 1. The Baath party rose to power using socialist platform. Sadaam entered office when it started. and though he had shitload of reserves of money and more than a decade to prepare when the oil prices droped the Iraq lost all its reserves and entered to debts It stoped paying. infact according to wikipedia During Sadaam's term the Iraqi economy has'snt even grown Wikipedia: "Nominal GDP grew by 213% in the 1960s, 1325% in the 1970s, 2% in the 1980s, -47% in the 1990s, and 317% in 2000s." CIA: "Per capita GDP during the period followed the downward trend seen in overall GDP. GDP per capita went from approximately $2304 in 1989 to $938 in 1990. From 1991 until 1996 per capita GDP never rose above $507" Middle East Policy Council: "Iraq's per capita GDP, which reached a high of $3.985 in 1980, declined to $1.097 in 2000." 2. Sadaam has produced way more oil than he was suppose to creating climate damage and hyper inflation. at the time Iraq was the second largest producer of oil in the world and nearly 70% of the Iraqi incomes came from oil. in the year of 1980 Iraq has produced 5% of its oil reserves BUT - He also brought drought to Iraq. Iraqi soil was so productive and rich for centuries it was described countless time in any middle eastern culture including at the bible. In order to punish resisting tribes he simply blocked the 3 rivers and created a 7500 square miles desert https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draining_of_the_Mesopotamian_Marshes In fact Sadaam left Iraq so weak and busy at wars that even after his death the three countries Syria Turkey and Iran kept leeching from Iraqi rivers. and that's not enough they pull their own rivers. nowdays Iraqi have far less water than they need. and with the temperatures growing up and deserts getting larger the draught is going to get worse. during our generation we gonna see tens of millions Iraqis relocating inside their country and outside to Jordan and Europe. "The policies Abd is referring to are the dozens of dams set up by Turkey on the Euphrates River and its tributaries, which led to a clear water scarcity in the river, threatening agriculture as well as fisheries, and resulted in an Iraqi water deficit of about 23 billion cubic meters (6 trillion gallons) annually. In addition, Syria has established dams on the Euphrates River, reducing Iraq's share of the water." Read more: http://www.al-monitor.com/pulse/originals/2016/12/iraq-environment-climate-change.html#ixzz550JcVinP https://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=112494850 ""It is a tragedy. I have planted 50 percent of the land while only 20 percent will survive till the harvest time. The reason behind this is the water shortage," Kafaji says." "Saddam didn't care about it, he didn't have a relationship with them," Rashid says, referring to the late dictator, ousted in the 2003 U.S. invasion. "When I was appointed minister of water I sent a message to Turkey and to Syria saying: 'Look, let us talk about the water issue, and this is very important.' They were surprised."[i] http://articles.latimes.com/2009/jul/30/world/fg-iraq-dust30 [i]"The lack of available water is a huge issue and it's having a huge effect on Iraqi society," said Silverman, social science advisor for strategic communications with the Army's Human Terrain System, a program that links social scientists and anthropologists with combat brigades. He emphasized that he was not speaking on behalf of the military. It's a dramatic turnaround for the country where agriculture reputedly was born thousands of years ago. Iraq's ancient name, Mesopotamia, means "Land Between the Rivers," and though about half the country traditionally has been desert, the fertile plains watered by the mighty Tigris and Euphrates rivers once provided food for much of the Middle East. Now the Agriculture Ministry estimates that 90% of the land is either desert or suffering from severe desertification, and that the remaining arable land is being eroded at the rate of 5% a year, said Fadhil Faraji, director-general of the ministry's Department for Combating Desertification. "Severe desertification is like cancer in a human being," he said. "When the land loses its vegetation cover, it's very hard to get it back. You have to deal with it meter by meter."      3. No body knows exactly how much Iraq really invested in welfare because they were hiding from the public and from the world their budget and expenses. but considering that their economy was not ready to any challenged and failed to grow in the long term we can assume that the level of corruption was huge. All we know that during Sadaam regime they produced more than almost every other nation and yet ended up exactly where they were in the 50s except they had dead agriculture now. But even though he sepnt "so much" on welfare. his citizens level of life kept decrasing while his friends keep enriching from oil revenues and he builds himself palaces from state money "Following the war with Iran in 1988, Iraq was ranked 50th out of 130 countries on the 1990 UNDP Human Development Index (HDI). This index measures national achievements in health, education, and per capita GDP. Iraq was close to the top of the "medium human development" category, a reflection of the Government's continued investment in basic social services. By 1995, Iraq had declined to 106th out of 174 countries and by 2000 it had plummeted to 126th, falling behind Bolivia, Egypt, Mongolia and Gabon and close to the bottom of the "medium human development" category. According to the HDI, an Iraqi born in 1987 could expect to live 65 years while citizens in bordering Jordan had a life expectancy of 67 years. By 1998 an Iraqi was expected to live only 63.8 years while a Jordanian saw an increase in life expectancy 70.4 years in 1998. Compared to Jordan, where the literacy rate rose from 75 percent in 1985 to 88.6 percent in 1998, Iraq's had dropped from 89 percent to 73.5 percent. In 1990, Iraq ranked three places above Jordan on the HDI. In 2000, Iraq placed 34 below Jordan." https://www.thenation.com/article/how-climate-change-is-threatening-iraqs-fragile-security/ Temperatures in Iraq last summer regularly topped 120 degrees for days at a time, which crippled the electrical grid in Baghdad. The power outages meant many residents had electricity for only a few hours a day and no air conditioning. As a result, thousands took to the streets in August took protest the government corruption and dysfunction that continues to plague the Iraqi government. Prime Minister Haider al-Abadi referred to the protests as an "early warning" sign, adding, "The people will resort to revolutionary sentiments if this situation continues." Iraq was not alone in facing extreme weather. The summer of 2015 was the hottest season on record, according to the NOAA. If trends hold, 2015 will be the hottest year ever recorded, surpassing the previous hottest year, 2014. World leaders will meet in Paris next month for a UN climate conference as scientists and activists continue to sound the alarm and warn that even the modest agreed upon goal of limiting a temperature increase to 2 degrees Celsius will have a disastrous effect on the planet. [i]  4. After he failed his attempts to expand the Iraqi economy never recover even though they tripled their oil reserves. economists was pushed out of the budget planning and it was left to serve politicans and protect the regime. with so much oil and potential. and society that wanted to be secular with decent leader like Merkel or Cameron Iraq could turn to superpower. but with useless Dictator like Sadaam it went to garbage.
1. In order to protect his regime Sadaam promoted Islamist radicalism like "Death to the Infidels", "West is colonist" "One Arab Nation". he basically created the moral ground in Iraq for Al Qaeda and Isis. "One Arab Nation" was basically to moto of the Ba'ath party 2. People of Iraq had no Justice. once someone was suspected to be threat to the regime he was trialed in Military Trial. where simple officer could execute him 3. Minorities were collectively punished with chemical weapons. supplies cut and sieges. 4. Read more about his mukhabarath http://adst.org/2014/06/persecution-of-the-kurds-the-documents-of-saddams-secret-police/#.WmcV16gjSF4
People like Sadaam should not be praised no matter how much he suited your agenda. people like him speaking against Israel only make a good effect for us.
- Sadaam failed to supress the Kurds uprise so he start chemical weapons genocide - Sadaam attacked Iran at its weakest form in history. fully boycotted and after civil war. and while he was funded by the rich Arab gulf nations not only that his offensive failed he got the Iranian army invading his lands and even chemical weapons did not help him to stop them. he needed to launch balistic missiles to Teherhan to get peace treaty. eventually Iraq went to bankprut and lost nearly half million people all in vain. if he was taking care of economy instead of promoting corruption and dictatorship he would'nt need it - Sadaam was about to be thrown away after the drop of the oil prices. so he threathened the Arab world he was suppose to unite so they will increase the oil price. when it failed he invaded Kuwait and guess what. he lost again - Sadaam Allowed Turkey and Syria steal Iraqi water. he made Iraq so strong Turkey gets 80% of Iraqi water - Sadaam was so genious he allowed Iran to bomb all his oil facilities and get him lose of 90% of his oil production - Sadaam was so almighty Israel has bombed his nuclear reactor he has done nothing about it I believe the rest of the subjects are covered
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Hence every time Khal replies to you and you ditch the topic because you have no counter arguments (what has occured hundreds of time) I am going to quote this message.
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You guys dont understand Middle East and muslim arabs. They are not like the rest. They certainly are not like the West or Israel. Take a dictator away from a South American or South East Asia country and most likely a new, better, democratic, modern, liberal, lawfull society will flourish. Take a dictator away from a Middle Eastern country and there will be a dozen different radical Islamist groups fighting each other for control and ruining the country, murdering everyone around. Saddam, like Libya and Syria and etc is just a dictator progressive in comparison with the Islamists and outdated/backwarded compared to the West. Their "crimes" are purely their attempt to keep hold of their country, with the rules set by the regional standards which are very different from the West, because if they get deposed there wont be elections but the extremist animals that lurk in the shadows will take over and chaos will ensue, just like it happened with Iraq and Lybia and will happen to Syria, should Assad fall. Following this line of reasoning, Middle Eastern dictators has done the same things that Western powers have done, to secure their nations superiority and sovereignty , they just played by different rules that came with the area and people. For example Saddam removing the Kurds was just business, same as Britain removed the Irish. They were both atrocities, one more subtle, the other more barbaric, but in the end the goals and the mindset behind both of those were the same. Saddam, just like Assad, aside the corruption and the oppression that are a naturally occurring phenomena due to the culture and history of those places, serve/ed as a stabilizing force and under their rule education, standards of living, healthcare, freedom of speech/expression, employment etc were/are higher than any radical Islamist regime. The rest is Western propaganda, evident by how the USA changed Saddam's status from terrorist to friend when they needed him in Iraq-Iran war, then switched sides when he invaded Kuwait because it suited their interests (when they said they wont interfere in arab-arab conflicts) and then proceeded to depose him using fake evidence and braking international laws.
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I sincerely hope that kebab gets hanged from the Blue Mosque or something
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#Free_Kurdistan
---- Do you fear death? Do you fear that dark abyss? All your deeds laid bare. All your sins punished. 
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I do not see how a non-dictatorical Middle Eastern state is an impossibility. Iran before the 1953 revolution was a democracy as democratic as any European one, it was only due to the meddling of the US and the UK that all that collapsed, and even now, after the Islamic revolution Iran hosts elections (eventhough the person elected is only one of Iran's two leaders) and eventhough it is a Shia theocracy Sunnis have never suffered something even slightly close to genocide. Moving into Syria, the Middle East's greatest point of contention at the moment, you can see Rojava, a canton-system direct democracy. Sure, it is a fragile and endangered endevour, but it was created by the local people themselves, not brought about and forced upon by an invasion, regardless of the fact that western involvement set the circumstances that allowed its rise. In Iraq, Iraqi Kurdistan might have an authoritarian form of government in some ways, but it is nevertheless elected by the people. In Egypt, after the two revolutions, a mostly democratic state was established and continues to function until today. It is a state with a free policy that opposes the Saudis without being aligned with Iran, and recently publicly condemned Turkish intervention in Syria, despite the Saudis' cries of "Go for it!". Of course, not every revolution in the Middle East follows this fate, but it cannot be said that it's impossible.
---- Someone Better Than You
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lol youre retarded if you think i "run" away when khal posts here. youre the one saying "ill reply when i get on computer unless khal already does". that tells me youre the one depending khal to support you on any anti-middle eastern topic you talk about. grow up little kid
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See what im talking about? you cant fight your own fights alone
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I hoped i can avoid writing long pointless comment because one I knew you are not going to do anything about it Two it's far more complicated for me than it is for Khal. if you would'nt start quoting and mocking me i would wait for the night to do it but frankly you are too much sometimes. Most of my comments are from my phone. in order to write long comment with resources like you demanded for me I needed to wait for gap in time get a laptop and hide myself while i'm spending more than an hour gathering resources for you. and you know what? I was eventually right You did'nt do anything about it except looking for opportunities for personal assaults (nice going recalling to reply after 2 days). And by the way. it's kinda arrogant and coward blaming me for ditching debate while it's in fact just what you did. you never replied my comment you just chose to personal attack me. Oh and the meme is funny because you cried to the mods and got him banned.
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I thought that was one thing that everyone agreed about. would you mind to express your opinion?
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See what Corrambo and Fappy posted, Saddam was loved in Iraq, and kept the region in check, him and Qaddafi have been falsely demonized
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Then we have to answer two questions 1. Who was he good for? For Iraq? We know he spent all its income for what turned out to be nothing and instead of developing society to nly devided and islanised the majority. Let alone permnant damage to Iraqi soil and foreign relations. Stability? In order to maintain his corrupted way of governing he had to keep the oil prices high even if he had to provoke war for it People? He got Iraq involved in so many scandals and wars he couldnt keep social benifits anymore no matter how much oil he had. Let alone the fact that he neglected Iraq and considering its huge oil reserves and small population was suppose to become super developed under any medicore leadership. Also remember that social benifits started inbefore it and the reason he is remembered for it was because Iraq used to be poor nation before oil was disovered. Compared to poorer western nations its nothing impressive West? He provoked 3 middle eastern conflict and even though he contributed to the arms industry planted the seeds for Al Qaeda and ISIS and funded terror everywhere 2. Could he maintain this system for long? History says nay
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Soldier001 Ce compte a été effacé |
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